Making Sense of the Ryan Strome for Jordan Eberle Trade by Andrew Taylor (@drewtaylor1978)

January 3rd, 2009.  That was the day I became a massive Jordan Eberle fan.  One of the most memorable play by play calls I remember, I can still hear Gord Miller yelling out “CAN YOU BELIEVE IT?!!!”  If you can’t recall that day let me give you a Youtube link to jog your memory:

In October of 2010, I bought a signed Jordan Eberle World Juniors jersey off of a guy on Kijiji for an extremely respectable price (he asked $350, but since there was no certificate of authenticity and I was planning to wear it anyway, I talked him down to the $200 a regular jersey would cost). Jordan Eberle was going to help bring the Oilers back to respectability, back to being competitive, back to glory.  I bought in, I was a fan.  Eberle, along with Taylor Hall, Linus Omark, and Magnus Paajarvi were H.O.P.E., and now all H.O.P.E. is gone.

When Edmonton finally clinched a playoff spot in March one of the reasons I was most excited was to see Eberle have a shot at translating that magic into meaningful post-season goals.  I guess I just assumed that he would rise to the challenge, and to be honest, I was more than satisfied with his efforts and results in the first round series against the Sharks.

When the challenge of the next round came up though, it seemed like he had simply ran out of gas.  Maybe he was playing hurt.  Perhaps the novelty of the playoffs wore off.  Whatever happened, Eberle had seemingly lost the drive.  Now, the Oilers as a team weren’t good enough to advance past the more experienced Anaheim Ducks, so putting the failure to advance to meet the Nashville Predators in the third round squarely on #14 would be both unfair and unproductive.

Any good enterprise needs to be able to survey the landscape and adjust to it on the run; continual improvement if you would like.  The idea is that if you can’t see and meet the needs of both your customers, employees, and market, you will get left behind.  For years the Oilers were not able to do that.  A lot of mediocre NHLers became very rich coming here to play as overpaying for free agents became a necessity and this transpired to their homegrown talent.

So making all of the salaries work while being able to add pieces is the real challenge of building a team in today’s NHL.  Players have always been assets, but now the cap space is as well.  If you overpay at one position you must offset it by underpaying at another.  If your second line right wing gets $6 million, you need to adjust what you can give your top two centres, and I think we can all agree that keeping McDavid and Draisaitl need to be a bigger concern than keeping Jordan Eberle.  If Eberle had a cap hit closer to $4 million he would still be here, and we wouldn’t be having this conversation; such is the business of the game.

The Numbers

I usually adhere to getting my stats from the NHL website (www.nhl.com/stats) as they are at least not supposed to show any bias.  Goals are goals, wins are wins, and standings are standings.  They don’t get into advanced statistics such as Corsi, and my belief is they choose not to because of the differences in interpretation.  If I look at that website and see that Connor McDavid has 100 points, then Connor McDavid has 100 points, there’s no reason for them to be inaccurate.

There is, however, one issue with their website.

I believe that it is an indirect result of the NHL’s collective bargaining agreement with their players’ association, but the stats make zero mention of salaries and/or cap hits; the information is available to the general public still through sites such as www.nhlnumbers.com.  The issue with the stats not correlating with the cap hits is the cap hits are essential in assessing the stats.  If two players are identical in every facet of the game, but player A makes $2 million per year while player B makes $3 million per year, then player A is the better asset (as players are shuffled throughout the league in trades, those worth more will bring back the better return).

So, if Jordan Eberle scored 51 points in 82 games, or 0.62 PPG, and Ryan Strome scored 30 points in 69 games, or 0.43 PPG, then Jordan Eberle is the better player right?  Yes, absolutely, as long as that’s all you focus on.  But Ryan Strome only costs you $2.5 million a year whereas Jordan costs $6 million.  So, if you double Strome’s cap hit as well as his PPG, he would have 60 points in 69 games, or 0.87 PPG (that would put him 5th in the league for right wingers in PPG while being tied for 16th in the league for right wingers in cap hit, so it’s obviously not that simple, but stay with me).  The point is, with all of these players having different cap hits and cap hits being a big factor, shouldn’t we involve it in deciding which player is better?

I have come up with a formula that might be a simple indicator for evaluating wingers in relation to the salary cap room they take up.  I’m not suggesting this is a be all and end all for evaluating all players, I’m not even saying that it is refined enough to use outside of this conversation.  But to emphasize why I believe Peter Chiarelli might have felt comfortable with today’s trade I think this can answer some questions.  If you divide points by cap hit in millions and add it to PPG, you can double both PPG and cap hit and the answer remains the same.

So, what do the results say?  Well, to no one who pays attention’s surprise, the best right winger in the league for that metric is Patrick Eaves.  At his minuscule $1 million contract and scoring 51 points in 79 games, I think anyone would take him on their team as their first line right wing, even though he was 20th overall for right wings in points in the NHL.  In theory, though, you use the money you save on a player like him to bring in, say, a better defenseman, you have better balance and a better team.

So where do Strome and Eberle place?  Well, there were 46 right wingers who scored 30 or more points last season, and 6 of them (Anthony Mantha, Connor Brown, David Pastrnak, Patrik Laine, Sebastian Aho, and Mikko Rantanen) were all under entry level contracts, which would skew their results.  So of the 40 players left, here are the results which are relevant to this discussion (note I have Ryan Strome on their twice, the bottom is to show how doubling both the PPG and cap hit keeps my metric the same):

I think it is imperative as Oilers fans that we keep some perspective about moves that are made for the next 10-15 years.  After all, we will have a second line centre that fans of many other teams wish they had for their top line.  This is going to cost though; at times we may have an optically questionable blue line, or our roster might need tweaking right up until the trade deadline.  Sometimes we’ll lose a fan favourite like Jordan Eberle and it’ll seem like they didn’t get nearly enough back.  But tell me you’d give up Connor McDavid and Leon Draisaitl for those issues to be solved.

And ask any Penguins fan if you can have success with lesser known players on your team’s wing, even on the first line, and an average defense core, as long as you have two really good centres.  If things go as planned for Peter Chiarelli and the Oilers, and their fans, H.O.P.E. will be replaced by actual winning.

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Two New Names Enter the Oilers Rumor Mill

A good friend of mine, we’ll call him Dave, sent me a message on Twitter the other day and offered me a scenario regarding the Oilers and the Islanders. Now, I know that’s not a rumor per se but this Dave contacted me about the Oilers signing Ryan Mantha last year months before he was signed and I trust him. We’ll get to why this is a rumor later on in the post.

But first I’ve got to ask you to listen to this clip from The Jason Gregor Show and tell me what you think they’re talking about.

Here’s what my friend Dave sent me:

Arthur Staple, the NYI writer, said this in an interview: “I would not be surprised if Beauvillier and de Haan are packaged in a deal for a top 6 F.” Stauffer dropping hints that the guy coming back for Eberle is a player that can play more positions in the top 9. Beauvillier is a C/LW.

Who are the top-6 forwards that have been rumored to be going to the Islanders?

  • Matt Duchene
  • Alex Galchenyuk
  • Jordan Eberle

https://twitter.com/NicholsOnHockey/status/877220734057160704

So there you have the Bobfather (Bob McKenzie) saying that perhaps the Islanders will go ALL OUT and trade for both Matt Duchene AND Jordan Eberle.

Bob Stauffer said on Oilers NOW (June 20th) that he expects the Eberle trade with the Islanders to go down shortly after the expansion draft. He also echoed McKenzie’s sentiments that the Isles may go for both Duchene and Eberle.

THE PROPOSED DEALS

Stauffer thought something like Josh Ho-Sang+Travis Hamonic for Matt Duchene might be feasible and I could agree there. Elliotte Friedman thought that the Oilers would have to pay much more than just Jordan Eberle for Hamonic if they wanted him. Plus, I don’t think that Beauvillier and de Haan would get Duchene out of Colorado.

As for Jordan Eberle, if we go from my friend Dave’s thoughts, that deal would look like Calvin de Haan+Anthony Beauvillier for Jordan Eberle.

On paper, those deals would jack up the Isles forward corps quite a bit but what about the salary cap? At the moment, the Islanders have about $4M available and don’t Duchene and Eberle make $6M or more per year each?

Hamonic – $3.85M per year till 2019/20
Ho-Sang – $1.075M per year until 2018/19
de Haan – RFA
Beauvillier – $894k per year until 2018/19

I’d expect de Haan to be signing anywhere from $3.75M to $5M if you take his comparables like Mattias Eckholm ($3.75Mx6), Danny Dekeyser ($5Mx6), Chris Tanev ($4.45Mx5), into consideration. I mean he made a shade under $2M last season, so

I mean he made a shade under $2M last season, so it’s likely he’ll double that depending on the team?

So when we bring it all together, Duchene+Eberle’s salaries are around $12M and the four players mentioned above combined are about, let’s say, $10M because we’re not sure what de Haan signs for. That leaves the Islanders with approximately $2M to play with but with no 2nd pairing on defense

Right now their defense looks as such:

Leddy/Boychuck
XXX/Seidenberg
Mayfield/Pelech

If they really wanted to, they could move Dennis Seidenberg to his native left side and move Ryan Pulock into that vacancy but that’s an awfully inexperienced bottom three defenders.

Bob Stauffer had another suggestion, he suggested that the Islanders move Mikhail Grabovski’s rights (and salary $5M) plus the Islanders first round pick (16th OV) to the Vegas Golden Knights for one fo their 1st rounders that they are likely to pick up from another team. This would open up some cash for the Islanders to play with and if Grabovksi goes on the LTIR next season, the Golden Knights are only on the hook for $1M because the other 80% would be paid by insurance.

That is only for 1 season as well and if they can move Kulemin to Vegas as well, that’d be a dream scenario for Garth Snow.

WHY BEAUVILLIER/de HAAN TO THE OILERS IS A RUMOR

Bob Stauffer has been touting Eberle to the Islanders for a very long time now but he’s only let it be known the return would be for someone that is,

“Cheaper and less established. That might give them (the Oilers) a few more options with regards to where you could move him in to the lineup”

Naturally, myself included, I jumped directly to Ryan Strome but that’s too easy when I think about it and I am of the belief that the Islanders new head coach Doug Weight (DOOOUUUUGGGGIIIIEEEE) is a fan of Strome and would like to work with him. Ryan Strome was nearly .5pts per game after Weight took over coaching duties.

Anthony Beauvillier is cheaper and less established and can play multiple positions and hardly anybody is talking about him, unless you type in “beauvillier isles” on twitter, there you’ll get all sorts of commentary as he’s being connected to the Canadiens (of course he is) and the Alex Galchenyuk rumors. Hence, why his connection to the Oilers is now a rumor. Yes, if Twitter is talking about it, it’s a rumor… lol.

Here’s what McKeen’s had to say about Beauvillier in his draft year and pay attention because a lot of Beauvillier’s character attributes are things that Oilers GM Peter Chiarelli really values.

Anthony Beauvillier has only turned 20 years old and deserves to be on a team that can shelter him and bring him along slowly. Having Milan Lucic, Pat Maroon, Ryan Nugent-Hopkins (maybe), Leon Draisaitl, Connor McDavid will certainly do that. He was a whiz on the faceoff dot in junior (not at all in the NHL yet) and perhaps that (3C) is where Peter Chiarelli could see him eventually. And wasn’t Beauvillier one of the pieces of the Griffin Reinhart trade? He was.

I think you’re probably asking, why would the Oilers need ANOTHER small forward? Didn’t we just go through years and years of trying to play with small forwards? And you’d be right in saying that but I’d have to say that the focus of such a trade wouldn’t be Beauvillier, it’d be De Haan.

I feel like I’ve oversold you on Anthony Beauvillier a bit and not even focused on the best part of that deal, Calvin de Haan.

In de Haan you’ve got a better and possibly cheaper player than Kris Russell.

Fenwick Against per 60 Relative to Teammates:
Russell: -.017
de Haan: -1.59

Shots Against per 60 Relative to Teammates:
Russell:-1.50
de Haan:-2.36

I like those statistics because they tell me how the other team is doing against said player. I like to look at a defenseman’s defensive stats if they are a more stay-at-home dman. And if we look at their “FOR” stats in both of the cases above, they are in the minuses, so that doesn’t help me much.

If you’re a Corsi fella:

Corsi For per 60 Relative to Teammates:
Russell: -7.38
de Haan: -5.13

Corsi Against per 60 Relative to Teammates:
Russell: 5.37
de Haan: 1.32

de Haan wins out here too even though the numbers don’t look great

If we take a gander at some more tradition stats, de Haan comes out on top more often that not as well.

Goals/Assists/Points/PIMs/Shots

Russell: 1/12/13/23/68
de Haan: 5/20/25/36/116

Hits/Shots blocked/Takeaways/ATOI

Russell: 67/213/36/21:13
de Haan: 139/190/24/19:51

It could be said that Calvin de Haan is a bigger better younger version of Kris Russell. They seemingly play the same style. I wonder if de Haan skates as well as Russell though. I’d lean towards no.

A deal like this wouldn’t address the Oilers need of a right-handed defenseman though and it would leave them short on the right-wing. Mark Spector talked about the Oilers signing Tyler Pitlick this summer and Bob Stauffer said that it’d be a shame if Vegas signed Pitlick.

I’m not sure if a RW depth chart of Puljujarvi, Slepyshev, Kassian, and Pitlick would do it? Possibly toss in a Spencer Foo and we know that Drake Caggiula can play across the board. There’s all sorts of potential though and if Draisaitl moves up, then it’s not a problem but only if Nugent-Hopkins stays.

My only problem there is if Duchene is moved out of Colorado, they’ll need another centre, and the Oilers want Tyson Barrie… So maybe you deal RNH for Barrie and you fill that RHD hole but you make another at centre, right? Is that where a signing like Derek Ryan comes in though?

You wouldn’t have to worry about defense again though and a young D-Corps of Klefbom/Larsson/de Haan/Barrie/Sekera/Nurse/Benning would be one of the best in the league.

You can never have enough good defenseman, right?

That said, how do you feel about this new rumor? Let us know in the comments below!

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Oilers Protected List LEAKED!!!

Long time Oilers journalist Jim Matheson has tweeted out what he figures is the Oilers protected list. I wasn’t surprised by who was included/excluded but maybe you are.

https://twitter.com/NHLbyMatty/status/876426523997229056

That means that Vegas can pick from this list of players from the Oilers:

  • FORWARD: Pouliot, Pakarinen, Khaira, Hendricks, Fontaine, Desharnais, Pochiro, Pitlick, Samuelsson
  • DEFENSE: Fayne, Fraser, Gryba, Reinhart, Russell, Musil, Simpson, Oesterle,
  • GOAL: Brossoit

So recently signed Jujhar Khaira, he must be outtie 5ooo then right? Between him, Reinhart, and Brossoit, they’re the most attractive players on the Oilers to Vegas unless they fancy themselves a bit of a fancy stats dynamo in Mark Fayne or Benoit Pouliot… But what if they dig a hard-working Finn with a hammer of a shot? Iiro the Hero might be that man.

Or has a deal been made….

The computer boys are going to nail Chiarelli for this list aren’t they? I Love it!

“KASSIAN!!! Are you kidding me?!!!”

 

That title is a bit over the top eh?…

What do you think about this list? Is it what you’re expecting? What might’ve you done differently? Let us know in the comments below!

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Oilers Rumors: Friedman on Phaneuf, Hamonic, Barrie, Eberle, and Vegas!

Our favorite insider Elliotte Friedman did his usual spot on Oilers NOW! with Brendan Ullrich yesterday morning and hit on a number of topics regarding the Oilers and what they might be doing before the roster freeze later today.

WHAT ARE THE CHANCES EBERLE GETS DEALT BEFORE THE ROSTER FREEZE?

EF: I think pretty decent. I don’t think there’s any doubt they’re going to try very hard. Peter is in the cone of silence about it. I tried to ask him a few questions about things that I was hearing and he was very polite about it and said, “Look, I’m just not going to talk to you about it right now.”

I think he’s really trying to get something done. I’m sure for Eberle too he’s sitting there saying, “I hope this ends sometime.” because he’s probably tired of the whole sage as well. 

I think if it’s up to Peter Chiarelli to get something done, he will. I think he’s really going to try.

SOME OF THE OFFERS CHIARELLI IS LOOKING AT

EF: I don’t know about the offers. I can’t tell you exactly on that. I think also too, the league is really trying hard to get the salary cap sorted out today. There have been reports today and John Shannon is one of the ones reporting it, the players are voting on a $75M cap and that is something that could have a direct influence on what some of these teams are looking at and what they’re going to be able to do. So I think that’s a factor in just about everything that these teams are talking about. 

I’m sure the Islanders are there, Colorado’s there, I always think there’s somebody there that maybe we don’t think about. That there’s a team there that we haven’t considered or you haven’t heard about. I would generally believe that that’s the case. 

I’ve said a couple of times now, I don’t know what to make of the whole Islanders situation. That quite simply when Kelly Buchberger was with Jordan Eberle, I know they butted heads sometimes. I don’t know if that’s a big deal or not and that means the Islanders are or aren’t interested. But I know a lot of people around Edmonton, they really think that the Islanders are the team, I can’t tell you that’s true one way or another.

I’ve always wondered if a team like Carolina could be involved but I don’t think they are. In that particular situation, I always wonder because they’re looking for offense.

THE ISLANDERS AND EBERLE

EF: From what I hear on Hamonic, the price is really high. I wonder if it’s higher than Eberle to be perfectly honest…

(It should be, given Hall was offered for Hamonic last summer.)

I don’t know if Hamonic is going to get it done unless there’s more to it than that. 

I mentioned a while ago that during the World Championships that Detroit was really looking at De Haan and he played pretty well there. And then someone said to me that after he played there, the Islanders might want to keep De Haan and maybe it’s Hamonic that Detroit goes for and I just heard that the price on Hamonic is really high. I think that’s more than what Eberle is and I think also, don’t forget, you talk about Edmonton and the choices you have to make with your cap with Draisaitl and McDavid, the Islanders have to do Tavares and I think everything that they do is going to be about Tavares. So, I just wonder if that’s a move they want to make. Hamonic’s on a great contract too. 

Don’t forget last year one of the reasons that Hall for Larsson was 1-for-1 was Edmonton was saving, what, $1.8M on the cap. So I think everything gets done, Hamonic makes less than Eberle but is a more impactful player at this point in his career. I’m not sure that that’s going to do it. I think that if it’s Eberle going to the Islanders, either it’s going to be more than him or there’s going to be something else involved. 

So I’m not convinced that that’s the deal that’s going to get made. 

COLORADO DEAL?

EF: I think there’s a lot in Colorado. I think there’s Tyson Barrie. Tyson Barrie is available in a pure hockey deal. That’s what I was told and I know Tyson Barrie, I’ve written about this before, he got injured at the World Championships, and I know teams were really disappointed because I know there were teams that wanted to watch him there. 

I think that Colorado is willing to do that but it’s got to be a hockey deal.

Now, you know what? Maybe that’s Eberle but I don’t know. I can’t say yes or no but I do think there is something that could get done there too. 

(That’s four insiders in a week, McKenzie, Stauffer, Rishaug, and Friedman; three in one day mind you, that have mentioned Barrie and the Oilers. Why is everyone focused on Hamonic still?)

HOW ABOUT THAT MATHESON TWEET?

EF: Are you talking about this Eakin for Eberle rumor? I kinda looked into it and I was kinda told it probably wasn’t going to happen. So my inclination is to say right now that’s a no. That particular deal.

(Friedman says “that particular deal” which tells me there’s another deal(s) on the table he’s away of… Wonder what that could be? Nichushkin?)

WOULD VEGAS OR ST.LOUIS BE AN OPTION FOR EBERLE?

EF: I think Vegas is going to have trouble finding scoring. I could see that and if I were a player, I’d want to go there. You know Fleury is going to be there. Initially, I think teams were hoping Fleury was going to get flipped out of Vegas but I don’t think that’s happening anymore. I think he’s staying. So, immediately you’ve got a player there that a lot of players would like to play with and a good goalie. 

To me, if I was Vegas, I would take a long look at Eberle. Simply because I see a team there that is going to need scoring and you know what? Maybe he’s a perfect fit for that. I don’t have any problem with a Jordan Eberle in Vegas and you know I’ve always felt that St.Louis is a team that could use offense but I don’t know if they’re in on him or not. 

I think the biggest question with Vegas is how many guys that are drafting and keeping?

Let’s say for argument’s sake they take Marc Methot from Ottawa, are they keeping that guy? Because I think there’d be a stampede from teams wanting him.

(Methot for Eberle?)

JJ

EF: I think one of two things are going to happen, either he’s going to get snapped up in the expansion draft or he’s going to be playing for Edmonton because that contract is a one-way. That says to me that he’s going to be playing in Edmonton next year if not picked up by Vegas. 

DOUBLE DION COMING TO TOWN?

EF: I think he would go there (Edmonton). I think the tough thing is, even if you get Phaneuf at $5M as opposed to $7M, that’s going to be a tough squeeze for you guys. 

Unless it makes sense from a point of view where Ottawa takes something off of Edmonton’s hands money-wise. I don’t know if that makes a lot of sense. 

It’ll be interesting though, Phaneuf is more of a grinder than a speedster, and you play in the one division where Anaheim’s a real grinding team, the Kings are a real grinding team, Calgary’s more of a speed team than a grinding team. If you look at the top teams in your division, you’ve got some real grinders there. Even San Jose, they can really grind with ya too. 

Phaneuf actually could make some sense in the Pacific division. That would just have to be a deal that would make a lot of sense to me financially before I’d believe Edmonton was going to do it. 

There are teams out there that worry more about term than they do about money and if you could get Russell for three years, would you take that over Phaneuf at four? I think you probably would. 

(Phaneuf has always interested me since his days in Calgary and I like Friedman’s point about the grinding teams. See, Phaneuf is very much in the Kadri/Bieksa role in that he’ll annoy players physically but he won’t engage them. If he could be had for a lower price-point, I would support that move.)

HENDERSON’S FAVORITE PLAYER

EF: I’m going to guess that those two guys have a pretty good idea of what’s going on there, the Oilers and the agent, I’m sure they knew before he even signed last year. 

(Russell is going to have some better offers this summer. He showed that he is a fine defenseman when played in his wheelhouse and with the right support. I wouldn’t be surprised if Calgary or Toronto took a run at him or if Boston wheeled back with another offer.)

If Travis Hamonic gets traded, and I think it’s possible he does, that’s a big trade. Whoever gets him is going to hurt a bit. They’re going to be happy to get Hamonic but they’re going to give up a lot. 

Listen to the whole interview right below!

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Bob McKenzie Clarifies Eberle Trade Comments

Bob McKenzie was on the Jason Gregor Show earlier today and they talked about a plethora of things including McKenzie’s upcoming Q&A event in Leduc on July 5th, the expansion draft, and most importantly to us Oilers fans, Jordan Eberle.

Here’s the Eberle segment from that interview:

JG: You’re expecting him (Eberle) to be moved in the next 24hrs?

BM: Well, I kinda qualify it as I usually do a million ways to Sunday. I mean, in this business there are no absolutes and there are no guarantees. Everybody wants them. Everybody wants me to come on and say,

“Yup! Jordan Eberle is getting traded for sure. He’s going to be gone.”

I can’t say that because I don’t know that. But what I do know is when you start to connect the dots a little bit and the dots that I’m connecting, we know that there are 6 or 7 teams that have been in relatively serious degrees of negotiations with the Oilers on Jordan Eberle.

We know that this is not just someone calling up and saying,

“Hey! I’d be interested in Eberle if you’re going to trade him!”

The talks on those fronts have been more substantive and therefore if you’ve got that many teams that far down the road, logic suggests that there’s a chance that a deal could get consummated.

The mere fact that they are going down this road, at this time, gives you a pretty strong indication that at some point Jordan Eberle is going to be traded.

Now, I said this on the morning show, there’s no fire here but the mere fact that the Oilers are getting as serious as they are about talking to these multiple teams and that there is the specter of an expansion draft that might motivate some of these other teams who are interested in Jordan Eberle to do that deal now, it leads  you to believe it’s quite possible it could happen but far from guaranteed.

And as I said this morning, Jordan Eberle doesn’t need to be traded at all if you don’t want to, that’s the first thing that people should remember. The second thing is, if you do say, “We gotta trade Jordan Eberle.”, the financial aspect of his contract, you probably don’t need that money for a year until McDavid kicks in and some of the other things that will be happening. You can probably get away without trading Jordan Eberle and absorb Draisaitl’s money into the equation but the fact that he didn’t have a great playoffs, the fact that there is still substantial interest in him, and the fact that they are talking to so many teams leads me to believe that it’s more likely than not that Jordan Eberle is going to get traded.

It really does look like Eberle’s time in Edmonton is finished and after two seasons under McLellan and Chiarelli is it not plain to see that his style of play simply doesn’t fit in? It’s too bad though, I liked Jordan Eberle and he’s a very skilled player. He’s going to make another team very happy but when your time is up, it’s up.

You can listen to the whole interview below!

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